Curse

makeitrain43 · Sep 07, 2011, 10:44 AM // 10:44

Expertise-13
Beast Mastery-12
Marksmanship-10

Strategy: Use pet as tank/consistent dmg dealer/best friend

Skill set: Symbiotic Bond
Otyughs Cry
Predatory Bond///Never Rampage Alone
Heal as One
Lightning Reflexes///w/e you want
Needling Shot
Poison tip Signet
Scavenger Strike

Outlook: Symbiotic Bond = zero cost due to crazy duration (cast 1st)
Otyughs Cry = Pet Armor Boost + Pet becomes unblockable
Predatory Bond = Pet 25% IAS boost, and heals ME 25 per hit

So far we have spent 7 Energy. Pet takes 1/3 Damage dealt to it, has a +24 to armor, Regeneration +3, ATK's are Unblockable, 25% IAS and steals 25 HP for ME. Not to shabby for 7E.

Heal as One = Every 5 second Heal Myself + Pet for 87
Lightning Reflexes = 75% chance to block 33% IAS (for me)
Needling Shot = 3/4 cast, fast moving arrow, Armor Ignor 23 DMG

So now I can heal Myself + Pet 87 every 5 seconds for 2E, Ressurect Pet if God comes in game and smites him, Avoid Dmg, IAS, Ignore Armor, ATK Fast for 2E, for Constant Minimum DMG of 23.

Poison Sig = Poison a target
Scavenger Strike = Extra +22 DMG for pet, now it steals E for ME

So, the last part of this combo deals extra DoT, extra DMG, and nets me a + 11 E gain. This combo takes 10 seconds.

Recap--> Pet has: Regeneration +3
Takes 1/3 of ALL DMG (33% DR from bein Pet, 50% SB)
+24 Armor (at lvl 20 pet now has 104 Armor)
Unblockable ATK's
25% IAS
25 Life Steal for ME the Ranger on every Unblockable Hit!

This combination of effects Lasts a minimum of 17 seconds. And can be renewed 13 seconds after it runs out (some dont even ware off)

Then Every 10 seconds it can deal an xtra +22 DMG, and steal 13 E (netting me 11E).

I the Ranger have--> +25 health every time my pet ATK's
+87 health every 5 seconds if needed for 2e
75% chance to block
33% IAS
PSN DMG every 6 seconds
Needling Shot***

*** If target is below 50% health, it auto recharges. 23 Armor ignoring DMG for 2E with a 4 sec recharge, potentially no recharge, with 11E comin in every 10 sec = spammable if im reckless.

ALL in ALL i have a hell of a tank, Steady DMG, Steady flow of Health and Energy. Bear shouldnt get hurt, I shall never fret. My needles will prick. Screw your armor and your DMG. Thats how me nd my pet roll [only lvl 5 with a pet flamingo ATM, so this is a work in progress].

Pets have an inherrent 33% DR. So if it gets hit for 100 DMG, it would only take 66. SB takes 50% of that, and sends it my way. SO out of every 100 DMG, the pet takes 33. I know thats not exactly 100% correct mathematically but the theory/logic is correct i believe. The inherrent 33 dr comes first.

So i guess im wondering what you guys think? would you go Never Rampage Alone or Predatory Bond? Lightning reflexes for defense and ias or expert focus for needle shot to cost only 1e and extra 7 or 8 DMG per needle?

How do you think this will fare NM HM? What do you think about the concept? I can take constructive criticism. Go crazy

cataphract · Sep 07, 2011, 12:31 PM // 12:31

I have recently threw together a skillbar in order for my ranger to have her pet make her company. Since I'm more inclined to do damage myself I specced in Marksmanship and ended up with something like this:

Burning Arrow - I *really* like to burninate stuff.
Scavenger's Strike - Pet used to give me some energy.
Distracting Shot - Never leave home without it
Read the Wind - Faster arrows! Moar damage! Yay!
Triple Shot - Xandra has Splinter for the win
Never Rampage Alone - What are pets for?
"I am the strongest!" - She is not. But she's very nimble.
Melandru's Assault - Always nice to have your patron goddess' at your side.

14 Marksmanship
10 Expertise
10 Beast Mastery

Fun to play.

Denar · Sep 07, 2011, 12:50 PM // 12:50

In NM you can run anything. This will "work" in HM because with 7 heroes and what have you, anyone can accomplish anything. But it wouldn't be as effective as say, Barrage with a rit hero putting splinter [email protected] on you. Pets are clumsy and weak (you've devoted your build to buffing another creature that will only deal single target damage).

Needling shot isn't effective at all. It's rarely run, and it's designed to take advantage of being able to spam whatever preperation is on the bow (like Choking Gas).

If you like using a pet rather than making a bow the central focus of your build, you're better off using the Dagger Ranger build.

wilebill · Sep 07, 2011, 12:55 PM // 12:55

The concept looks good. I will try Needling Shot in my build. Just suggestions based on my hard mode experience and thinking of EoTN environments.

1. Asuran Scan is very helpful against nasty dinosaurs. No use shooting if your arrows are blocked. Then too, the DP removal will come in handy in HM.

2. Call of Haste never leaves my pet bar. Pet moves and attacks 25% faster. Get at his throat there, pet. Rip it out! Good boy! Prefer it to Never Rampage Alone because I get my IAS from candy when needed. Nick the Traveler is sometimes useful.

3. Otyugh's Cry is excellent. Still thinking of those dinosaurs.

4. With the right heroes, I don't find Poison Tip Signet that useful in HM. With casters in the party to do armor ignoring damage, boost damage output of me and the pet, interrupt and so forth; things are usually dead before the poison has time to do much. Then too, it takes valuable time to use the signet.

My build is fairly conventional Beast Master but I do have room for Needling Shot and I will give that a try.

What I really like about your presentation is the detailed analysis of the skills and how they work together. Good! Unlike me who just slaps skills on the bar and sees how things go. it is a terrible thing not to have a mind!

Oh, one final bit of perhaps useful information. Depends on the area, but the Vampirism Spirit from the Sunspear Title Track can often come in handy. I use it enough that it was worth maxing Sunspear to get the full life stealing and healing from it. Then too, it often makes a good pulling focus. Go drop spirit midway between, pull, and run back to group who can open fire on targets while they are taking down Vampirism. It is a tough little spirit and will hold them for a couple seconds.

Especially when out with a pet, but for any melee in the group it is very useful to take along Melonni Dervish with Avatar of Melandru for condition removal. Nothing worse than a blind or weakened or crippled pet! Then too, Melonni does a good enough job with damage to be the sole melee in addition to the pet making space for another heavy caster and a rit with spirits!

Vekk, E/N with OgRDQ8NMP1CahhYSM02dg13A really rocks.

On the whole, Ranger is my best char in HM. And as Ranger, Beast Master. Pets rock if you do it right. Don't know why so many people hate pets, mystery to me. Add on Call of Protection for heavy damage situations, 19 damage reduction at 14 beast mastery, with decent party healing the pet is almost invincible!

loopysnoopy · Sep 07, 2011, 04:39 PM // 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by cataphract

I have recently threw together a skillbar in order for my ranger to have her pet make her company. Since I'm more inclined to do damage myself I specced in Marksmanship and ended up with something like this:

Burning Arrow - I *really* like to burninate stuff.
Scavenger's Strike - Pet used to give me some energy.
Distracting Shot - Never leave home without it
Read the Wind - Faster arrows! Moar damage! Yay!
Triple Shot - Xandra has Splinter for the win
Never Rampage Alone - What are pets for?
"I am the strongest!" - She is not. But she's very nimble.
Melandru's Assault - Always nice to have your patron goddess' at your side.

14 Marksmanship
10 Expertise
10 Beast Mastery

Fun to play.

How are you bringing your pet out with a build like that?

But to the OP My bar usually consist of

Triple Shot, fun with splinter.
Distracting shot, no ranger should leave home with out it.
Read the Wind
Scavenger Strike, even rangers need a tad of energy management.
Heal as One (E) hey its cool.
Never rampage Alone very simple and cool skill for a vamp Bow.
I Am the Strongest!
Then a res of choice

Att spread as follows

Expertise 10 +1 (11)
Beast Mastery 11 + 2+1 (14)
Marksmanship 9 +1 (10)

Bow of choice is a flatbow Vamp 15^50 +30hp

Does some nice damage in hm content normal well that's a different story as everything in nm is a breeze but I do like your concept when I get home I'm definitely going to try it out.

Calista Blackblood · Sep 07, 2011, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by cataphract

I have recently threw together a skillbar in order for my ranger to have her pet make her company. Since I'm more inclined to do damage myself I specced in Marksmanship and ended up with something like this:

Burning Arrow - I *really* like to burninate stuff.
Scavenger's Strike - Pet used to give me some energy.
Distracting Shot - Never leave home without it
Read the Wind - Faster arrows! Moar damage! Yay!
Triple Shot - Xandra has Splinter for the win
Never Rampage Alone - What are pets for?
"I am the strongest!" - She is not. But she's very nimble.
Melandru's Assault - Always nice to have your patron goddess' at your side.

14 Marksmanship
10 Expertise
10 Beast Mastery

Fun to play.

Without Charm/Comfort?

Xenomortis · Sep 07, 2011, 06:08 PM // 18:08

You depend on the AI for damage so that's not great.
Don't take Lightning Reflexes over NRA when you have a pet. I don't see why that would ever be a good idea.
I'm torn between Enranged Lunge and Heal as One; the Deep Wound and +damage on Enraged is pretty good. If you're killing reasonably fast then the DW from Enraged will probably do more damage than the life steal but your pet is a little less robust. Heal as One is decent bar compression.

Since you've not gone with a Warrior secondary for SY, I'd recommend dropping the bow and using a spear instead; it does more damage and is more energy efficient. Poison Tipped Signet is junk, use something else to trigger Scavenger's Strike (Enraged is good for that), Needling s barely passable and DShot is seriously overrated in PvE.

cataphract · Sep 07, 2011, 07:03 PM // 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by loopysnoopy

How are you bringing your pet out with a build like that?

I'm pr0 hax0r obviously. XD

Was typing the skillbar from memory, being at work and all, and wrote skills I shuffled around without much attention.

Xiaquin · Sep 07, 2011, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denar

Needling shot isn't effective at all. It's rarely run, and it's designed to take advantage of being able to spam whatever preperation is on the bow (like Choking Gas).

With the right build it can take advantage of pure damage buffs and hit for almost 90 before ally buffs and/or weapon spells. I've run builds that work and can still bring a pet that doesn't die. Enemies tend to favor more squishy targets anyway, unless you literally pet-pull and let it take the brunt of aggro.

Wenspire · Sep 07, 2011, 09:03 PM // 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

I'm torn between Enranged Lunge and Heal as One; the Deep Wound and +damage on Enraged is pretty good. If you're killing reasonably fast then the DW from Enraged will probably do more damage than the life steal but your pet is a little less robust. Heal as One is decent bar compression.

I found the constant need of renewing HaO to be annoying. Enraged would probably be better. Though I did like using Strike as One. Nothing beats teleporting pets. Too bad they lag after they teleport or it would be much better.

Denar · Sep 07, 2011, 10:46 PM // 22:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

With the right build it can take advantage of pure damage buffs and hit for almost 90 before ally buffs and/or weapon spells. I've run builds that work and can still bring a pet that doesn't die. Enemies tend to favor more squishy targets anyway, unless you literally pet-pull and let it take the brunt of aggro.

zz take sloth-hunter's shot if you want single target damage. Again, "builds that work" or "it works in PvE" seems to be a mantra now to try and defend poor, inefficient bars.
Sure, you could take Favourable Winds, Conjure X, IATS!, EBSoH and 3 other damage buffing skills so Needling Shot makes a big number, but you you avoid the question of how useful needling single enemies that are already under 50% is. On any standard mob, the other heroes will have some way of killing this enemy quickly, otherwise you bring FH!
Anyway, my main gripe isn't with that specific skill, but with the concept. How on earth is centering that build around single target damage effective? I mean, even AP nukers can create walls of ebon assassins or other aoe effects as well as spiking down a target, but this does nothing spectacular.

As before, if you really want a pet, use; http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:R/A_Dagger_Pet_Ranger
or even;
http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:R/W_Infuriating_Savior

but there's a reason that they're in good rather than great. If you disagree, feel free to post a pet-focused build onto that site and see how it fares.

Xiaquin · Sep 08, 2011, 01:46 AM // 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wenspire

I found the constant need of renewing HaO to be annoying.

It is, actually. If rangers ever get an update, I'd like to see it extended or reworked.

cataphract · Sep 08, 2011, 06:07 AM // 06:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denar

As before, if you really want a pet, use; http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:R/A_Dagger_Pet_Ranger
or even;
http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:R/W_Infuriating_Savior

but there's a reason that they're in good rather than great. If you disagree, feel free to post a pet-focused build onto that site and see how it fares.

First build is an Assasin with a pet and the second one is just bad. Bringing Infuriating which takes up your elite and has 3 sec cast time just to fuel your SY! faster is a retarded idea. Triple Shot + FGJ! + Frenzy = win. And in most cases you don't even need Frenzy.

Amy Awien · Sep 08, 2011, 06:58 AM // 06:58

I'd bring volley in stead of needling shot and splinter weapon on one of the heroes; it can deliver a really nice punch once in a while, making it a good use of the skill slot.

Quite a lot of defence in there, not saying it isn't usable but heroes are usually quite capable to keep you and your pet alive and with a more aggressive build you may find you can kill a lot easier.

Denar · Sep 08, 2011, 11:35 AM // 11:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by cataphract

First build is an Assasin with a pet and the second one is just bad. Bringing Infuriating which takes up your elite and has 3 sec cast time just to fuel your SY! faster is a retarded idea. Triple Shot + FGJ! + Frenzy = win. And in most cases you don't even need Frenzy.

Actually, the first build is a ranger using daggers with a pet. Using daggers provides the best dps a ranger can get by itself, and also allows stuff like Strength of Honor which is imba on daggers.
Bringing Infuriating does take up your elite, but so does say, Focused Anger (which is used for exact same purpose, obv) but has the added benefit of giving irremovable Dark Fury to all your physicals. And consider spirit range, and the fact you're attacking from a distance anyway, and the 3s casting time is negligible. If that's awful, you can make an edit on the talk page expressing your view (anyone can edit there, and it would only take a sentence) and surely everyone will agree with you and trash the build.

Xiaquin · Sep 08, 2011, 02:15 PM // 14:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denar

/snip

You need to realize that I never stated NS was some godly skill. -You- said it wasn't effective at all, and you are wrong.

I'm not sure where you got the idea that improving damage to NS somehow meant damaging via the pet. When I buff NS, I damage through my bow. If I have a pet, it's usually there to annoy enemies (and hopefully not me), or else I'd run EL or HaO.

Here's a perfect example of a situation where NS can beat daggers: isolated enemies, usually more in mid-to-late battle. You don't need to move to deliver high damage, fast-moving arrows as quickly as you can press the skill button. Melee does not reach those targets before my arrows do. I can tab and find <50% enemies and take them down while melee deals with other threats. As soon as the party wears something else down, I can finish that off as well. In the mean time I have other things to do.

Sadly, it's strategy like this that gets you booted from pugs because meta players don't have the capacity to tolerate more than three builds.

Calista Blackblood · Sep 08, 2011, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

Sadly, it's strategy like this that gets you booted from pugs because meta players don't have the capacity to tolerate more than three builds.

Meta builds are meta builds for a reason,they are as close to if not the best bars available for a particular task/role. You wouldn't take a knife to a gunfight right?

The beauty of pve is the fact that anything will work and anything can be called "good" because of that,the reality is that tried and tested builds (meta) are still very much above the capability and understanding of many players today,something which often appears here on guru.

Xenomortis · Sep 08, 2011, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calista Blackblood

Meta builds are meta builds for a reason,they are as close to if not the best bars available for a particular task/role.

Actually the 'meta' bars are meta because the PvE community is terrible.

Xiaquin · Sep 08, 2011, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calista Blackblood

Meta builds are meta builds for a reason,they are as close to if not the best bars available for a particular task/role. You wouldn't take a knife to a gunfight right?

I understand the analogy, but I don't bring knives and not everyone likes melee, so saying one build is better than the other when it completely changes how the profession is played is moot. Daggers plays like a sin, not a ranger. Scythe plays like a dervish, not a ranger. It's apples and oranges.

Quote:

The beauty of pve is the fact that anything will work and anything can be called "good" because of that,the reality is that tried and tested builds (meta) are still very much above the capability and understanding of many players today,something which often appears here on guru.

I might be misunderstanding you, but meta is above whose capacity?

Calista Blackblood · Sep 08, 2011, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wenspire

UA/HB included?

If either was the best possible option to fit the purpose,why not?